Most people suck; we still need people.

Yeah, I feel we do have to balance the hyperindividualism of today's times, where people are increasingly unwilling to accept anything less than a perfect fit for their needs and tastes in everything – which is overall a good thing of course, especially when it comes to women and dating. It can also be isolating when taken to the extreme. No person on this planet will never annoy you, disagree with you, be unavailable sometimes, have zero obnoxious mannerisms. No, I don't recommend settling for subpar men romantically. But I do recommend being realistic about the flawed nature of humans, and realize that sometimes they are indeed doing the best they can and that can be good enough. We can use all the kindness and support we can get (as long as the trade offs are nothing too major, of course). Yeah sure you can get all your basics needs met by never interacting with any human being whatsoever, but I don't feel that's good for us in the long term.

" I let her lecture me about the importance of lowering my standards" If I had a dollar for every time I've had to do this.....

It's better to be alone than with people who make you feel alone.

Thank you for posting this. I relate to so many points and have similar conflicts with certain people in my life. I think the key to avoiding loneliness is nuance and critical thinking. My closest friend is a woman in her fifties who is having a fling with a married man. This is totally against my ethics and moral code, but that’s her choice not mine. Said friend is also savvy, supportive, hilarious company amongst lots of other lovely things. Posters have indicated on a few of my posts here that I should drop her but, as you pointed out, the net effect would be negative for me so she stays. We need people. All people are flawed. Plus we fuck uk too and there will be times where we need that grace. Boundaries are important, though, and everyone has their limits. I think there are elements of the handbook that need a refresh on matters like these. That goes for online dating (some of us literally have no other options), having a roster of prospects and perhaps other aspects that I’m overlooking here. *cowers from potential backlash* Yes, have high standards and implement them where necessary, but not at the expense of your isolation. We should strive to keep the best possible company in every facet of our lives.

I see where you're coming from with this. I have a few women in my life that I wouldn't class as friends, more like acquaintances. Some are family members. Some of them are on the pickme spectrum or making... questionable... decisions with their lives. I could cut them off completely bit I don't if they have been there for me in other ways or are not inherently awful people, just people who aren't exactly sensible. Then again, this is possible because there is no limit to the amount of friends/acquaintances you can have. If something isn't ideal but it works, that's okay! It's different with men because unless you live in some parallel universe where male harems are a thing, you'll only have one husband at a time. So it's really important, imperative even, that you make the right decision, vet ruthlessly and block at the first red flag. Choosing a man who is only okay half the time could literally mean ruining your life. Eventually cohabiting with someone who isn't the right fit for you would be a whole different nightmare to occasionally associating with a woman who has some pickme tendencies. I wonder if this is an age thing to some degree too. The younger you are, the easier it is to discard friends and make new ones. For older ladies, this might be more difficult. At school and uni, I knew girls who fell out with friends at the drop of a hat and blocked them over small differences in values or misunderstandings. I'm seeing a whole lot less of that in my mid 20s. My mother is in her 50s and has a lifelong friend who is a raging pickme she has barely anything in common with. For context, she is the sort to make excuses for men cheating and shame random women on the street because she doesn't like how they're dressed. When I asked her why she hasn't cut contact with this woman, her response was that they've known each other too long now and she has been there for her at lots of difficult moments in he life, so she keeps her around. It's interesting to think about.

Deciding who remains in your life is a cost-benefit analysis. Adjusting your degree of association and the perimeters of the relationship can help achieve a more favourable cost-benefit ratio. Take into account their character in your cost-benefit analysis as their character reveals patterns of behaviour that you may not want to experience in the future.

Essentially... lower your standards, which is what FDS is against... You know- reddit would happily tell you how amazing your father is despite treating the woman who gave him a legacy and worships the ground he walks on like absolute shit 🙄

I see a lot of Trauma in this post. Hugs. Family court abuse is so horrific.

The triangulation part about your mom being traumatized by your father, who is good to you and your kids, and your mom not being able to show up for you without hypervigilance instead of being a listening ear - that’s painful to read. Must be hard to navigate it all sometimes.

My cutoff game got to where it is today because I don’t want to end up trapped with an abuser. I hope I don’t get fooled by men who are selectively cruel and nice, but never truly kind. There’s an ocean of difference between nice and kind. My romantic cut off game got good. Then my shitte friends cut off game got good. Lastly, my family cut off game appeared when my parents harmed my kid. I'm older now, and grew up without strong boundaries the kids learn about today (hopefully). I should have cut them off years ago, but I was surrounded by PickMe messaging about giving chances.

“If we cut everyone out because they don’t meet our standards, we’re going to live really lonely lives” is thinking that can also keep people stuck with abusers. It’s a useful strategy, however, to believe this as long as we need it to stay safe with unsafe people. Ask me how I know.

As they say in 12 step literature “take what works and leave the rest!”

I needed to read this thread, thank you.

I am also very selective with who I let in inside my inner vortex of my most deepest thoughts and feelings, but it's mostly a trauma response tbh. I've dealt with a lot of people hurting me in a lot of different ways. Female friends would pull a fast one on me for me having the audacity to look good whenever we all hang out, and male friends never have pure intentions with me. One managed to sexually assault me and it nearly shattered me completely.

Obviously I am careful not to get too close from obvious wallflowers and abusive people, but I too have less than perfect people in my life that I really can't let go of because it would leave me with absolutely nobody right now.

I've always dreamed of having a very few super close friends who can celebrate with me, cry with me, drive me to the ER in a nick of time, etc. I'm scared I'll never get to experience this. It just seems like something that only happens to a very few lucky people in this world.

I think the bar needs to be higher for a husband than for casual friends.

i dont think it should be lower than the bar for close friends.

And i would not be close friends with 99% of men i

I totally get this but there are definitely going to be people you meet but don't mesh with well. I am have a habit of cutting people off over what seems like not much ( my mother is also like this ) , but I'm having a hard time figuring out if the people I'm feeling annoyed by are actually people I don't get along with well or dislike enough to not talk to or if it's just a normal amount of things to dislike about someone. I made a post and as I was typing it out it made me realize that I didn't actually like these people but I'm reading this and now i'm rethinking

> But if we cut everyone out because they don’t meet our standards, we’re going to live really lonely lives.

Story of my AvPD ex's life (and also a fact that helps me sleep at night).

I'm inclined to agree with you OP, but maybe that's because my parents and friends actually aren't that bad and so I can't really imagine what it's like to be embedded in a group with almost exclusively LV peers. Personally, I don't have any friends who are the "throw you under the bus" style of pick-mes but I have tons who let men walk all over them because they have low self esteem. That's a kind of flaw I can tolerate, since it doesn't really affect me.

I did cut out all of my male friends though and don't really regret it, but that's because male friendships tend to be shallow and purely based around mutual hobbies, so you don't really feel their absence when they're gone. I treasure my friendships with women and while I have a pretty rocky relationship with my mom, when I look at the sort of scrotes who cut women out of their lives I never want to end up like them and so I still try to be patient with her.

If we cut off toxic people, it doesn't mean we will be alone forever. There are so many people we haven't met yet.