I think the financial coercion/power dynamic and exploitative element makes enthusiastic consent near impossible. Most people will look at me like I’m crazy if I say prostitution is paid rape though.
Prostitutes do not want to have sex with their Johns. If they wanted to sleep with them, they wouldn’t require money to do so. The money is the coersion.
Johns are paying money to sleep with people that don’t want to sleep with them. That’s rape.
This is a difficult concept to talk about because sexual coercion is so common we don’t really think of it as rape, and if we start talking about this being rape, we’ll have to talk about all the married women having sex with their husbands that they don’t actually want to have being victims of sexual assault and all of their husbands being rapists.
I’m generalizing because that’s the reality for MOST sex workers. The 1 percent you’re talking about are also being exploited, they just have more freedom to get out when they want. They’re tourists. Well they start out as tourists, and then get stuck along the way, and then say they like it as a coping mechanism. Why do you want to focus on a small subset of sex workers who don’t represent the majority of sex workers?
Unknown member
Jul 14, 2022
Replying to
It's a troll. Don't feed.
Unknown member
Jul 15, 2022
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because youre generalizing and therefore your statements are wrong
If money weren't changing hands, women would not be sleeping with these guys. The money is to "buy" consent, but the mere existence of money in this transaction means the woman wouldn't be doing it otherwise.
And when polled, something like 97% of sex workers said they would rather be doing something else for money. Sadly we only hear the loud sex workers who claim it's empowering. Yuck
Yes. I know there is a very small (yet loud) subset of full service sex workers who claim to love sex, love their job, love their clients etc, however in most cases women turn to prostitution as an absolute last resort to survive. These women might be homeless, they might be struggling to support their families, they might be opioid addicted (where sudden withdrawal is painful and lethal), etc. When you’re not able to say no, it’s not enthusiastic consent.
I'm a former stripper & OF model, also did some escorting a couple times. There is absolutely no such thing as enthusiastic consent in sex work. If you wouldn't do it for free, it's not empowering and you shouldn't be doing it for money (I feel this way about all work). There is no such thing as a man who is healthy and sees sex workers, it's not a thing. Prostitution is paid rape because if you wouldn't do it for free, sober, doing it for money (and/ or while on drugs/ alcohol) is the same thing as being coerced into it by some frat dude at a party. There's literally no difference between prostitution and some guy coming up to you and telling you if you don't fuck him, he'll take your house and car away.
The 1% of sex workers who say it's empowering are coping.
22
Unknown member
Jul 11, 2022
Men who buy prostitutes want sex without consent. They want sex with someone who doesn't want to have sex with them unless they are paid.They are rapists.
But to put it in simpler terms: in any other service industry, can a customer pull your hair (and this is only a mild example of what scrotes do) and consider it "part of your job to take it" instead of straight up assault?
In theory, even within prostitution, people don't have to do anything they didn't agree to. The "I love working in the sex trade" people go on and on about that. But in practice, if a john forces a woman to do something that wasn't agreed upon, would a court really convict him of rape?
Reminds me of guys that use "definitions" to get away with things. "I didn't cheat because we were together since highschool, but we never said we were "exclusive". So, by definition, I didn't cheat!". I feel so bad for the girls that get hurt so badly when they discover things but can't argue with his "logic" or "definition". I really hate that in that moment the girl is just expected to stop hurting as if he explained her feelings away.
There is an article from feminist current that sums up why prostitution is paid rape. It’s an interview with a women who wrote a book on the reality of prostitution and what women really are “consenting” to. Also feminist current has a plethora of articles on dispelling the myths around “sex work”/ prostitution. “But what is she consenting to? She’s consenting to the money, not the actual sex. If you say to any prostitute: “You have two options: either you can take the money and just leave or you can take the money and also stay for the sex,” how many do you think are going to stay for the sex? Not even a die-hard defender of prostitution will claim that most will to stay for the sex. Most of them are going to take the money and leave — which goes to show they don’t actually want the sex — they want the money.”https://www.feministcurrent.com/2014/01/20/being-and-being-bought-an-interview-with-kajsa-ekis-ekman/
Practically speaking I could go on and on about all the trafficking, trauma, drugs, and other issues surrounding prostitution, but ideologically speaking, I'll just say, if you can't consent if a gun is being pointed at your head, then you can't consent if you're being threatened by homelessness and hunger either. There's lots of good resources that go deeper than any post can. I recommend: Home - Nordic Model Now!
I hadn't thought about it that way, but yes. I always thought that the money was a way to buy absolution (in their minds). i.e. money paid is the difference between a service rendered and assault.
Prostitutes do not want to have sex with their Johns. If they wanted to sleep with them, they wouldn’t require money to do so. The money is the coersion.
Johns are paying money to sleep with people that don’t want to sleep with them. That’s rape.
This is a difficult concept to talk about because sexual coercion is so common we don’t really think of it as rape, and if we start talking about this being rape, we’ll have to talk about all the married women having sex with their husbands that they don’t actually want to have being victims of sexual assault and all of their husbands being rapists.
If money weren't changing hands, women would not be sleeping with these guys. The money is to "buy" consent, but the mere existence of money in this transaction means the woman wouldn't be doing it otherwise.
And when polled, something like 97% of sex workers said they would rather be doing something else for money. Sadly we only hear the loud sex workers who claim it's empowering. Yuck
Yes. I know there is a very small (yet loud) subset of full service sex workers who claim to love sex, love their job, love their clients etc, however in most cases women turn to prostitution as an absolute last resort to survive. These women might be homeless, they might be struggling to support their families, they might be opioid addicted (where sudden withdrawal is painful and lethal), etc. When you’re not able to say no, it’s not enthusiastic consent.
I'm a former stripper & OF model, also did some escorting a couple times. There is absolutely no such thing as enthusiastic consent in sex work. If you wouldn't do it for free, it's not empowering and you shouldn't be doing it for money (I feel this way about all work). There is no such thing as a man who is healthy and sees sex workers, it's not a thing. Prostitution is paid rape because if you wouldn't do it for free, sober, doing it for money (and/ or while on drugs/ alcohol) is the same thing as being coerced into it by some frat dude at a party. There's literally no difference between prostitution and some guy coming up to you and telling you if you don't fuck him, he'll take your house and car away.
The 1% of sex workers who say it's empowering are coping.
Men who buy prostitutes want sex without consent. They want sex with someone who doesn't want to have sex with them unless they are paid. They are rapists.
You pretty much already articulated why.
But to put it in simpler terms: in any other service industry, can a customer pull your hair (and this is only a mild example of what scrotes do) and consider it "part of your job to take it" instead of straight up assault?
In theory, even within prostitution, people don't have to do anything they didn't agree to. The "I love working in the sex trade" people go on and on about that. But in practice, if a john forces a woman to do something that wasn't agreed upon, would a court really convict him of rape?
There is an article from feminist current that sums up why prostitution is paid rape. It’s an interview with a women who wrote a book on the reality of prostitution and what women really are “consenting” to. Also feminist current has a plethora of articles on dispelling the myths around “sex work”/ prostitution. “But what is she consenting to? She’s consenting to the money, not the actual sex. If you say to any prostitute: “You have two options: either you can take the money and just leave or you can take the money and also stay for the sex,” how many do you think are going to stay for the sex? Not even a die-hard defender of prostitution will claim that most will to stay for the sex. Most of them are going to take the money and leave — which goes to show they don’t actually want the sex — they want the money.” https://www.feministcurrent.com/2014/01/20/being-and-being-bought-an-interview-with-kajsa-ekis-ekman/
Practically speaking I could go on and on about all the trafficking, trauma, drugs, and other issues surrounding prostitution, but ideologically speaking, I'll just say, if you can't consent if a gun is being pointed at your head, then you can't consent if you're being threatened by homelessness and hunger either. There's lots of good resources that go deeper than any post can. I recommend: Home - Nordic Model Now!
I hadn't thought about it that way, but yes. I always thought that the money was a way to buy absolution (in their minds). i.e. money paid is the difference between a service rendered and assault.