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"He drinks the respect women juice"
"He is well versed in feminism and we talk deeply about feminist topics"
"He always talks about women's issue and seems caring about anything women-related"
And blah blah blah.
Look -- I know it is exciting to finally meet a guy who seems excited as you are about feminism and women's right issue and all that -- and always talk about how he respect you and women and this and that -- and you think "OMG I finally found the one!"
Here's the thing -- words mean nothing.
Most people have functioning brain, are properly educated, have access to tons of materials -- and most importantly, have all the time in the world to train their mouth to spew out diamond and golds.
They have tutorials and seminars on that shit ffs.
Plus we live in a polite society -- everyone can learn from everyone about how to play the polite persona in public.
Sis -- he knows what you want to hear. That's why he says those words.
Do you really think he couldn't see how desperately you want a man to finally agree with what you say?
Do you really think he couldn't recognize how desperately women as a whole want to be seen, recognized, validated, appreciated, feel heard?
It is all part of the system, understand?
We all grew up severely lacking in self-confidence, and carefully groomed to only associated self-worth with being "seen" by that man.
Why do you think all these "You are worthy" speech from other women feel "good" at best -- but the instant that guy says "Wow, you are smart" or some other bullsh*t -- you feel like shouting from a cliff and jumping around like a fool?
That's right -- nothing can top that man finally "seeing" you, right?
I am not one to br- You know what? Let's be honest, I am bragging. I am gonna full on bragging right now. Prepare your ears.
I have complete apathy towards men. That means I am not wired to care about them at all. I don't understand why I have to care about them in any way, shape or form.
I do care about my late father and my little brother (because they care about me) -- I think that's good enough.
So men's words mean nothing to me.
So I honestly, and deeply -- don't understand why male "feminist" and male "ally" are even a thing -- and why women seems to celebrate and revere them so much.
They are just bunch of males saying stuff you want to hear -- what's so special about them?
Saying words are easy, sis. Anyone can do that -- hell, I can say exactly the kind of words that made it seem like I genuinely care about a complete stranger -- because you can train that kind of skill (and you happen to be born with a certain wiring);
But deep down, do I really mean it?
Hell nah. It is a fun game though, I'll give you that.
Especially when you met someone who is clearly passionate about a topic.
And feminism and women's right is the topic that can click with almost every women you came across -- especially the passionate, fiery, full-of-energy youth.
Plus it is the same old-ass rule;
If he says he is this and that that paints him to be in a highly favorable light -- he is for sure ain't those claims, sis.
He has a mouth -- of course he is gonna speak and try to convince you he is your best choice. This in itself isn't inherently bad -- that's just how dating works -- he is gonna try to impress you so that you will choose him;
But if he tries to do that by painting himself as a male "feminist"?
Be aware that you are now dealing with a parasite.
Male "feminist"
Male "ally"
Ass-kisser
Love bomber
Praise-vomit machine
Overly "romantic and poetic" guy
They are all the same damn type.
They rely on words and bombastic gestures to get your attention.
And within this type, male "feminist" and "ally" leverage their intelligence and word-smithing to get you hooked.
Do they care about the things they talk about though?
Hell nah.
A man who talks too damn much are a red flag of its own.
Adding to that his NEEDS to show you how great he is and how "knowledgeable" he is about women's issue and how "deep" he is -- that's why all he talks about are "deep" stuff ON A DAMN DATE -- you gonna have to start recognizing the difference between a wise man, and a plain ol' Mr Ivory Tower Dweller with a huge dose of God Complex.
(Also I understand being deeply passionate about a knowledge, but a man deeply obsessed about a woman's only topic is just plain creepy)
You have to ask yourself;
Why in the damn bloody hell do you want a male "feminist" anyway?
Validation?
Recognition?
Attention?
Feeling that you are finally "seen" and "heard"?
You gonna have to start asking, really asking yourself -- why do that gender's words matter to you so damn bloody much anyway?
Yeah -- you were INVISIBLE as a child -- so you grew up desperately wanting to be heard by that gender specifically. Know why you grew up that way?
Because THAT'S exactly what they want you to be.
Desperate
Chasing
Wanting
Begging
To finally be "seen" by them.
Meanwhile them and their beloved bros all laughing and sneering at how "gullible" we are.
Male "feminist" my ass.
No, we should NOT "exercise acceptance" and "hear their side" and blah blah blah.
Because you've heard too damn much already growing up, did you not?
If you want to play acceptance and be the big-hearted gal -- go out there to the open, wide world. And deal with their bullsh*t yourself.
Don't drag whatever crap you are playing to this site.
WOMEN'S ONLY forum is WOMEN'S ONLY for a damn bloody reason.
LibFem did that -- look what happened to them.
If you can't stomach the way this community is built;
RESPECTFULLY, GET THE F**K OUT.
Come back here when you are ready.
"But I want to vet his stance on feminism!"
I don't know what the heck people these days talk about on a bloody date -- but why are you talking about feminism on a bloody date?
It is like talking about politics on a bloody date -- that's... weird.
Alright -- you want to vet to know his stance on feminism and politics and all that -- but just like I said earlier;
Words mean nothing -- especially on a damn bloody date.
Of course he is going to talk about things you want to hear -- provided that he isn't too far up his ass and end up loving the sounds of his voice too much.
"So what now? How should I vet him?"
You know, it fascinates me how awkward we all actually are, when it comes to dealing with other people.
Especially dealing with a man on a date.
You are so overly self conscious, so you overthink.
When you overthink, you over-worry.
When you over-worry, you get too deep into your own head -- because your brain goes into overdrive.
It is to the point you don't actually SEE the person in front of you.
Notice I said BRAIN -- that's right, women are naturally LOGICAL on a date.
That's why women are the CHOOSER -- your brain are WIRED to, almost immediately, start analyzing the suitability of the man in front of you.
But you are also overly self conscious, so you overthink.
When you overthink, you over-worry.
When you over-worry, your brain, which is already busy analyzing and processing -- is going to go into overdrive.
When your brain goes into overdrive, you get too deep into your own head.
So you don't exactly SEE the person in front of you.
You cannot vet when you cannot see the person in front of you.
Start talking about deep ass topics won't save you from this inability to SEE -- gonna make it worse actually.
Because when your brain gets into overdrive, you get extremely exhausted.
So you, in an attempt to "make sense" of what he is talking about, latches into any of his words that "clicks" with what you want to hear.
And male "feminist" will most certainly say ALL the words that "clicks" with what you oh so desperately want to hear.
So you will fall for him. Because he "sparks" something inside of you.
Go on a normal date, ffs.
Vetting means observing. Not James Bond-ing your ass on a date.
Vetting means don't overthink, over-worry, and getting your brain into overdrive.
SEE him -- and SEE him as a human being. Not this idol-like being put on a pedestal that you are so desperate to be seen and heard from.
You CAN recognize when another human being is making you uncomfortable, can you not?
If you feel like you cannot yet recognize when a guy is treating you like shit -- don't go out on dates.
Vetting is just that -- not falling for words, for praises, for acts, for personas.
You SEE and OBSERVE him -- not trying to rush to reach a goal, not being impatient, not trying to fit him into your box of "the one".
Take your time, see if you like this guy enough to go on another date. And another, and another.
A decent man will act decent all the way through -- because he isn't acting. He isn't trying to lure you with a false mask.
If he cares about you -- you will KNOW it. He doesn't need to spell it all out and shout to the world that he is a male "feminist" ffs.
A man claim he is a male "feminist" or "ally" or other similar bullsh*t on a date? -- RUN.
Remember, it is the old ass rule: If he has to SAY that he is a "good guy" -- he is definitely NOT a good guy.
Stay safe, Stay WOMAN.
I don't hate anyone, but..
I hate male "feminists".
I am instantly turn off by them as a human.
I'm so angry at the libfems and their dick worshipping ways.
They got us to a point where men feel entitled to be included in feminism and tell us what feminism is or should be.
Feminism is being ruined by the fact that libfems are too scared of disapponting their scrotes and bruising their ego.
They have reshaped feminism to suit their submissive role towards men and avoid conflict with them.
Wonder why males are "feminists" these days..
Any man who claims to be a feminist subscribes to the libfem, male-pleasing brand of feminism. 100%. I've never seen a true feminist man. Even those whose values align with radical feminism are not feminists to me, and they don't call themselves that either, because they know their perspective as men is too limited to really speak on women's issues. The best allies I've met were eager to learn and knew how to shut up when women were talking about their experience. A man who claims to know more than or even as much as women in a female field of expertise is full of shit and also a walking red flag. We don't need men to agree with feminism, most of them won't because it's against their best interest, but we have use for men who don't sabotage us and support us on our way.
Male self-described feminists are the worst LibFem “Feminism For Men” assholes who make everything about themselves. Major 🚩 Two of the worst “male feminist” guys I know from high school come to mind. Both have chronic illnesses and are married to the most beaten down, quiet, divorce-averse, stuck wives with 3+ kids who also work, win the bread, caregive, and do everything at home for these scrotes - these are the “male feminists” who try to mansplain feminism to me.
They are obsessed with their tomboy Californian daughters and believe they are trans. 🙄 Their little performative dinner party woes about hopefully turning those daughters into transmale sons apparently gives them lots of street cred with other fake woke white ppl. One of them had watched Chappelle's Netflix special and learned to call me a TERF over nothing when I wasn’t one at the time… which eventually led to me thinking things through some more about these structures and who benefits (men!) and actively deciding to be Team TERF! Ironic. 🤣 Team TERF here because I got disgusted watching white dudes in dresses scream insults at black women in the name of trans people, as if white men are really the most oppressed group of all. 🙄🙄
It's all an act. It's all about them. They are worse than men who actually provide and stay out of women’s business.
I went on this date with an Albanian guy from Serbia back on 23 December 2017. I remember he told me that he voted for Hillary Clinton, and as he said it, he nearly choked on his scrambled eggs. So I knew that he was telling me what he thought I wanted to hear, since we were in NYC. I'm actually a libertarian and don't like either "side" of politics, so I figured I'd f*ck with this guy a bit. I told him that I admired Trump for having all of his kids in his business and that they at least were all working and not doing illegal stuff. Once again, he nearly choked because I said that, and then he started spinning his wheels trying to appease me about Trump.🤣🤣🤣 It's fun to mess with guys if you peep game. Just give it right back to him like a tennis match.
I've just emerged from a nightmare with one of these bullshitters. They are the most dangerous type of manipulator. The better "communicator" they are, the worse it gets. The key, as you've said, is to ignore their words and look at their actions and how they live their life. The guy I mentioned works in a notoriously misogynist field and has a public platform in a major publication, yet he does not use that platform to challenge the status quo. That was all I needed to know about him.
Men can't be feminists. Feminism is the women's movement. Only women can join the womens movement. Men are relegated to ally status at best. Any man who calls himself a feminist is so ignorant about feminism that he doesnt even know that there's a large percentage of actual (female) feminists who believe that that title is reserved for women only.
Feminism used to be centred on consciousness raising for this reason.
It used to say that "the personal is political" for this reason.
It used to revolve around the analysis of intimate relationships for this reason.
Now we get told all this is old and passè, but it's not.
This is still the way.
It's just that women are now cowardly running from themselves and if they don't want to, there is no movement left to turn to.
Then gaslighting yourself becomes easy, or even necessary to get peer approval.
Personally this is the hill I'm willing to die on socially. Men have no place in feminism and I will shout it from the rooftops, regardless of what the libfems are saying of me behind my back.
And any male who think that I might want his input in his oppression of me is a delusional narcissist.
Can’t even begin to tell you the number of times some scrote floating around my periph got the slightest inkling about me being pro-women and how fast and hard the tune changes to parrot all the BS above. Three times I’ve had this happen in just a couple of years and the surface fakery is soooo cringe and obvious.
Amazingly put, OP!
I definitely got burned hard by this type once before. What you described about this desire to be seen and validated by a man as a woman is so succinct and needed to be said. And what's crazy is that I'm about to finish up a book about healing as a woman after years of childhood abuse + domestic violence and why it is so, so, so important to find home within yourself instead of finding home in someone else. Especially with a man. I will write the book review when I'm done this upcoming week.
We really need to work hard on validating ourselves, hearing and seeing ourselves first, and getting to know our inner child to heal before we get out there into the shark tank that is heterosexual dating. Otherwise, we will keep falling for this type of scam with men over and over again. It starts with us.