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From a group of women in a group chat. They're all married or have been committed for years and waiting for the guy to propose after years. I'm the only single woman in the chat. They were taking turns venting about their men when they each have been casually misogynistic towards them.
I chimed in, agreeing that it's BS, and that cultural misogyny is a men's culture problem that goes little to nowhere when women explain it to men, because misogynistic men won't treat women as full human enough to listen to them in the first place... because thats the nature of misogynistic culture. They aren't going to listen to women on this, men need to do something about it towards other men, educate their fellow men, call other men out, etc for real change.
Misogynistic men just aren't going to be very motivated to change a system that already benefits them so much, ya know? And especially not if it's only women talking to them about it. The ones below them. The ones to talk over. Etc. 😮💨
That was the gist of what I said. There was no response from the 6 of them... until later, one said, "in other news, my bf bought me TWO of the grocery items I've been trying to find!" And the group chat suddenly livened up again.
Why do I even say anything. It's disheartening. Even more so when the chat is mostly these women airing their grievances about being mommies to their husbands/boyfriends.
I muted this group chat. It's lonely sometimes!!
I thought I could find solidarity with FDS ladies on this. Thanks for reading.
Leave the chat. They probably already made a second group chat to talk about what you said.
Relevant quote to your situation:
The main question you will get here is: why are you in this group chat in the first place? I agree that keeping it muted and not engaging since they don’t want to hear you is a good start, if you are not okay with simply leaving it permanently. Many women are too scared to be alone, and the suggestion that they should not shoulder every burden in order to be tied to a man is uncomfortable to them. It’s not exactly personal against you, but it’s tiring to raise radfem talking points that this audience will continually fail to properly acknowledge and internalize. Save your energy for seeking out and cultivating relationships with true radfem/HVW/happily single women friends. I hope you find solidarity and worthy friends beyond all of us here on FDS ❤️
i understand, sis! it does feel very lonely!
i don't even bother to discuss (real) feminism with women (or anyone tbh) these days. i wait to see if they are at least well informed and have critical thinking before bringing up anything feminist. i was so excited to learn about sorority years ago when i found feminism, but now it's just so... discouraging.
they get very defensive when i talk about **my own personal** experiences with not wearing make up, learning to love my body hair, rethinking femininity because it's detrimental do women, etc. and if i joke about wanting men to move to a different planet or something, they think i'm an extremist. it's like i'm messing with things that are very important to them. maybe i am... and i know it hurts when we open our eyes and see all the misogyny, but keeping things the way they are now also hurts. so what's the point in ignoring it???
i don't know, sometimes i think all is lost and there's just a handful of women who are truly willing to open their eyes and change their reality, make better decisions for themselves, level up. and that's very sad because when we choose to simply accept that "boys will be boys", we reward men for their shitty behaviour. that's what these women are doing. it makes me really sad.
Someone on FDS suggested the Gender Knot by Allan G Johnson. I picked it up last night and finished in one sitting! Fascinating read! Men are scared of other men and don’t speak out against them because of this fear. Forget everything you’ve heard about men feeling superior; they’re scared shitless of other men and they take their fear out on women. This really opened my eyes and made me see misogyny in a different light. Remarkably, I feel so empowered with this new knowledge and I am more grateful for being a woman than I have ever been ( gratitude that was immense to begin with). Love you FDS! Keep those recommendations coming. P.S. Would love to start a post that discusses the book if anyone is interested.
i feel you, sis! sometimes you just don't wanna burn bridges so you stay yet don't make yourself known. who cares if there's a separate chat without you in it 🤷🏻♀️
I've been in your position before. In a group chat (or in person) with women who are all partnered with losers. It's very lonely because they'll inevitably turn on you when you dare suggest dumping the loser.
I was on my neighbour's patio the other night and both men present were zero value. His gf was there too, and she wants to have a baby with this moron. He had zero redeeming qualities, and was openly homophobic, racist and misogynistic. Oh, and she was Mexican...I stayed out of it.
Uhh i feel you. So many women dont want to see the truth because it would mean they have invested so much of their lives into something that ruined it.
I also have a friend who when I told her about FDS, thought these values where crazy. It stems from growing up kinda shielded and having a dad who actually cared about his family. She didnt understand why a man should pay for her expences because as a woman she faces more injustice. I said nothing, knowing she would see it eventually. And its happening. Slowly but still, she is seeing the connections and the reasons for womens change in attitude. So give it time, you never know maybe they will change. However, its not your job to fix anyone, i would leave this chat just because its so awful lol.
Also: There are some women in privileged positions that might never get it either, like a huge reason my friend didn't think she should have a man take care of her financially is because she is studying medicine. She thinks she is safe, but seeing all the women here with successful high paying careers is proof that you always have a target on your back as a woman. And not every woman has this option anyways, so I dont understand why so many women are still opposed to that idea. Anyways, kinda a different topic but its something i noticed.