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Many of y'all know me: I'm 55, widowed seven years in August, haven't dated or tried to date, just having fun living life, enjoying retirement. My art has bloomed fantastically. I'm living around family, friends, community.
I chat online, and men online have asked me over and over if I've dated, then expressed "surprise" or shock and disbelief when I say I haven't. Apparently I'm unapproachable, something I've worked hard on my entire life. Men simply don't speak to me out in public, which is fine by me. I'm a strong introvert, keep to myself, mind my own business. I have no problem speaking up and speaking out, but I'm not social with random people.
My question is this: at my age and older, why be involved with men? It seems heretical, but I'm also probably late to arrive at this conclusion. I'm theoretically open to a third and hopefully last relationship, but not looking; I'm busy living my life and having fun. So many men (who don't know each other) have pleaded, OMG, don't give up on love! that it seems they all have an intuition that indeed, they know they're not needed, and also not particularly wanted. And it's not that I'm against love at all; love is fantastic. I'm just indifferent. I've been loved well and truly the second time, so there's no settling for less. And it just seems like all the men I've met are just less than. I'm way too much for most of them, and I own it. There is no shrinking.
That "urge to merge" that was so prevalent in my teens and 20s? Gone for decades. Twice married, 25 years, nearly half my life: I've been there and done that. I have my own money, more than one income stream. I'm around family and friends and community, so I see people, and have people around me. I'm post-menopausal so the chaos of excess hormones has died down, thank heaven. I have a toy that gets me there 100% of the time, never complains, never needs to rest, has zero erectile issues, never needs a pill, and has no asshole attached. I give it attention only when I want to, then put it aside. I also know that I'm demisexual, so I don't develop feelings quickly; it takes a LONG time, months if not up to a year, I'd imagine, maybe more. Those three years that late husband Jack and I spent emailing and phoning, talking about everything? Blissful even if it was a LDR: we formed a super strong attachment that ensured we were highly compatible, had the same goals, and were friends first. That was gold.
These days, though, men seem to have changed, or is it me who's changed, or both? I suspect both. I've grown, changed, matured, deepened, gotten a lot more experience in life. I just know that young people seem to be more aligned: both mostly want careers, to buy a house, to have kids, to build a life together, and I get that. I've done that. But men these days, what with the porn revolution, the rice of incel non-culture, the "threat" from independent women and feminism which has sparked a total backlash of machismo and the alpha crap... dating just seems daunting, way more so than it did when I was younger.
Also, what value do most men bring? I'm having a hard time seeing that. They all seem to be super needy, clingy, and/or controlling, so hard pass to all that, without even having to think about it. I want someone who actually adds value to my life, not just able to open jar lids (ha) but someone who's genuine, empathetic, consistently kind, dependable, and who basically worships the ground I walk on. I want someone I can do things with, and we have his, hers, and our interests. I want someone who's also a strong introvert, who likes living apart together, because we both need our own Hobbit-holes to recharge in.
And one last thing: I'm really not into most men my age, I've realized. So many have let themselves go or just don't seem to take care of themselves; do they even know how? So many seem to want 1950s relationships like their fathers, and women absolutely don't want that, my age or any age. I live in a really nice condo with a lot of other women, and all the women I know and have talked to here and elsewhere celebrate peace, quiet, freedom, independence. Those who are happily married are married to good men who are egalitarian, fair-minded, consistently kind. It's why I'd insist on living apart together, and I'm open with men: it means no extra cooking, cleaning, caregiving for me, and I'm all about making my life easier. That's a test to see how that statement sits with them.
What say you all? Any older feminists here want to chime in? Younger feminists, I want your views as well. I'm certainly physically attracted to men, but mentally and emotionally, they need to slow way the hell down, and get to know me for me first and foremost. Thanks, all. I don't post here as much, but still adore this community.
Millennial feminist here 🙋♀️
I feel the way you do, and I’ll be 30 this year. I am divorced, no kids.
Can confirm young people are not aligned. Men only want to reap all the benefits of a career, to buy a house, to have kids and build a life together; but only by burdening the woman with the responsibilities, so they can do the bare minimum amount of work it entails.
I’ve encountered a generation of men who are seething with jealously of their female spouses. They cannot genuinely be happy for our accomplishments. They have a toxic scarcity mindset.
If we take something that is rightfully ours, they feel we are taking it from them. Could be a job, a house, even a woman exercising her reproductive rights, they see as taking away their progeny.
It seems like in my mother’s and grandmother’s days they liked us more because we weren’t a threat. We didn’t have shit and we were opressed. Now that we are taking what’s ours, they hate us for it.
I am 48 and starting to feel this way. At this point, if a man doesn't treat me better than I treat myself, he is not a benefit to my life and I prefer to stay single. I find saying these words out loud to males helps. "I will remain single until I meet a man who treats me better than I treat myself. And I treat myself very well!'
I'm in my 30s. I want to be in a loving relationship. I want the same things as you--to be loved and adored, someone who is crazy about me, someone I can have deep and meaningful conversations with, someone I click with and who stimulates me. I really want a great love. I'm not sure if it will happen. It seems like the world really devalues women as we age, but I think women get deeper and smarter and more interesting as they get older while men seem to regress, to latch on to their childhood, to chase after youth and superficiality. I don't know if I'll ever find the kind of man I'm searching for. I hope I can make peace with a single life and create more community, connection, friendship, and joy in my life.
I'm 64 and I could have written much of this! 😁 Single since my last relationship ended almost exactly 15 years ago, I knew, even then, that I wouldn't get into another relationship. I have a much better time as a single woman. I downsized to a small apartment by the sea (UK-based) almost 3 years ago and, nowadays, I do whatever I want to do - mainly working out, walks by the sea, reading and learning things. Although I'm very much an introvert, I have great neighbours - most of whom are also single and we keep an eye out for each other without being too intrusive. I am, what social psychologist Bella DePaulo would call, 'single at heart', despite having been married for 14 years and in another 8 year live-in relationship.
I love to see positive 'aging as a single woman' posts like this to counteract all the "you'll die all alone surrounded by cats" crap we see out there. Don't threaten me with a good time!!!! 🤣
I would just be blissfully single at your age esp if you'd already experienced a loving marriage. Your standards are high because of that too so why put yourself through the stress of dating men all over again. It's not worth it.
I’m 30, no kids and never married, and have pretty much arrived at the same conclusion as you.
If I’m being honest, the only value I see in having a man is a second income. Inflation + the cost of living is skyrocketing and society was designed for couples (aka two incomes 🙄). My only way to combat this is to make more money, so I hope when I’m you’re age I’ll be financially stable and able to live comfortably.
Like you I don’t need the intimate aspect, so other than sex and money, you can find all the other fulfilment from having friends.
I'm a younger millenial/older Gen Z with older parents. I lost my dad about a decade ago and my mom was widowed at 56. I once asked her if she was ever going to remarry, she scoffed and explained that there wasn't a point, that she had two beautiful children, a beautiful life, and that she didn't see the use. Despite not looking, she wasn't exactly closing any doors: there were a few men here and there that she humored for a few weeks, but she ultimately dropped them because they weren't good enough (or their values misaligned, which is what she mentioned more often).
Three years later she found a HVM who had lost his wife to cancer many years ago. They met at a work meeting and kept in touch. This man is incredible and a better father than my father could ever be. I suspect my mom chose him because he brought nothing but value to the table, on top of having common values, a similar status and a great deal of similar life experiences. Now she's got a partner to share her life, her home, and to go on trips with.
On top of everything- my brother, who is the King Among Scrotes, HATES the man because he's threatened by his quiet confidence and strong character. Because of this man, my brother can't manipulate my mom or try to rule over the family unit anymore. It is extraordinary to watch 😂
>Also, what value do most men bring?
negative value
Foster a female community .Women are communal. At least they were before patriarchy made women compete against each other for men. Create a female community and you'll get the support you sought in men.
This makes sense. Women are naturally the gatekeepers of reproduction, which goes along with the fact that men need us, but we don't need them. It is in our nature to stick to ourselves and other women if there are no suitable males to reproduce with, or if the environment is not conducive to successfully raising offspring. It is in men's nature to work hard to meet womens' standards, so thet they can be selected to pass on their genes. And as women get older and age out of the childrearing phase of our lives, we have less use for men than ever. Women even live longer than men, because we can easily get by without them.
Unfortunately, men invented patriarchy and religion to force women to rely on men for survival, and ensure that men don't have to do anything to be worthy of a wife and children. Now it's our DUTY to procreate, rather than our perogative. Some cultures are even so damaging to women's health (looking at the middle east and south asia) that women in those cultures die earlier than men. Patriarchy has ruined everything.
It sounds to me like you've won the game of life. I hope this is what lies in store for me as well.
Even for opening jars, there are tools that make brute strength unnecessary. Look up "Lee Valley Jar Opener" to see what I mean.
I think you have the right attitude, really. I wouldn't call it "giving up on love". You're discerning, it's not a bad thing at all.
Zillenial here!
You just described my dream life in a nutshell. While I still live my parents, we pretty much have separate lives. If possible it would be nice to find a guy, but it’s not a priority to me. I want to live that double income no kids lifestyle, but if it’s not possible I’m fine with my toys 😝.
I have plans to move out once I finish paying off loans and finishing grad school.
Granted, I do admit that I do have toys, but I have never laid with men that aren’t married to me. It’s just not worth the hassle, heartbreak and emotional turmoil. I choose not to reciprocate feelings after 3-4 months. In addition, I will catch myself if I ever sense them coming into fruition.
Well, I guess the point is, if you're lonely - but...the scrotes out there though...🙄🙄🙄
But a problem is, and I feel that I really need to be careful about saying this, since I was a caretaker for an elderly parent - but I increasingly incur the risk of having to diaper the man, the older I get. (Please God forgive me for saying this)
I would recommend watching this video!
The video is from a YouTube channel called The high powered podcast. I am in my mid-20s, but I'm asking the same questions you are.
https://www.youtube.com/live/5R_1qk_ppeg?feature=share
I guess the "point of a romantic relationship after a certain age" would be much the same as the point of having one at a younger age, minus the possible childbearing.
I am a little bit older than the OP, and after two marriages (first is now deceased; second one came out as trans, and we divorced), I took a few years to recalibrate and reconnect with myself.
Overall, the recalibration/reconnection went very well. I did make some major and minor errors, but I learned a lot about my own standards and boundaries. I didn't do OLD but I encountered scrotes in the wild. Hoo boy, did I ever!
I rebuilt my life, started creating a nurturing home (a process still continuing!), renewed some old hobbies, started some new ones. I "leaned in" more with my career and also started some side gigs that were fun, lucrative, and related to my field. I traveled a bit, worked on deepening the best of my friendships, started reading more widely, went back to keeping a journal, and started learning a new musical instrument and playing with other people. Pushed myself out of my comfort zone a few times, in a good way., and reawakened my creativity. Started working intentionally on my physical health. Lost about 65 pounds and started weight-training. I also signed up for some mind-stretching courses via Udemy and discovered that I like math.
I got to the point where I was sincerely not looking for anyone. I was actively resisting well-meaning attempts to meet this or that person.
I was introduced to a man (IRL not online) via one of his relatives, and I talked to him for about 4-6 weeks before agreeing to a date. I've written more about this on another post, but the first date was good, but not one of those mythical Big Gesture first dates (I don't like those; too much like lovebombing). We dated for about another month and a half before making it exclusive.
Our values align; our personalities mesh interestingly (more like dovetailing than meshing, I guess). We meet on common spiritual ground; we play music together; we tell each other what we've been reading about or studying. We have serious and silly moments. We hike, watch old movies, go out to eat, and play board games and word games. Physically we are also well matched (I won't go into details, but that's a big relief, especially after my earlier experiences.)
His devotion to me is authentic and true and faithful. I have been vetting him strenuously. Having learned to recognize the tiny signals that my mind and body send out to me, I am wayyyyyyyyy more alert and vigilant than ever before.
We still live in our own places. We see each other once or twice a week and keep in close touch the rest of the time.
Based on every other (single and available) man I've met in the last few years, I feel pretty confident in stating that if I had not met this man, I would definitely not be dating anyone. The pickins' out there are SLIM. I feel pretty fortunate. HOWEVER, as I've mentioned in other posts, I know that if he proved to be LV, I would be able to stand on my own.